A vegan nation - how?
Tags: care, demographics, economics, essay, ethics, foreign, geography, health, laws, military, More…
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Mag de Ville on -
I think before any of these hypothetical questions can be answered the glaring issue of even FINDING land should be addressed. To go from a group of similar people to being incorporated as a country could possibly take hundreds of years (i.e. Israel) It seems much more feasible to establish some sort of colony within an established country. It's just an observation.
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Permalink Reply by Jonas Hellö on -
I know, it will be hard for us to get out of that catch 22. But I think, nevertheless, it is rather important to keep the discussion up on what we want for that country (and what else to do meanwhile?). I think we might fool ourselves if we believe that veganism alone will unite us, and that everything will be fine once we settle on some good land; perhaps we can hindre at least some of the possible conflicts if already prepared for them, or even having resolved them already.
But everything will become a lot easier once we can all meet for real, at the same place, at the same time. As of now we can't even hold particularly good conferences, due to the time differences - or is there some time during the day that would be reasonable for everyone here, from around the globe?
I am also just interested in knowing what you all dream of; it inspires and gives hope.
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Permalink Reply by Desiree Meisner on -
Here is how I see things when it comes to idealistic views: Politic: I am a fan of Socialism, in a less extreme way. I think naturally small group benefit immensely from this. If the group grows to a larger size, that is when democracy needs to be reigned in a more stricter manner. Economics: This ties in a lot with the political decisions. Again it matters on size. Smaller sizes would of course have to split general taxes already on land and development, while a larger group can then incorporate an official tax system. The founders of this nation will have to be the bearers of many financial issues and will pave the way for a smoother lifestyle later. I think when it comes down to it, you're going to have to develop two systems: a temp and a long term. Taxes are very necessary for non edible items of course, otherwise you are going to stunt your growth. Geography: This is a hard one. I hate to say we have to go with what is cheap, but unless we get a financial backer, I see many problems if not ever getting this thing off the ground. Other than that I think a primarily warmer climate would be desirable, if even attainable. Ethics: Something for a council to be judging. Appoint them first, then things will fall into place. One thing that must be upheld is law and order as well as position. if position falls, you have anarchy (the not fun kind) and it will all fall apart from there. Military: Militia, volunteers. Health care: This will have to be exported unless we can find a health related vegan to bunk in. I think everyone prefers free healthcare. We would have to study the economy and habits of the nation before we can offer anything other than general healthcare without hurting the economy. Foreign Policy: This is tricky and delicate. Thinking about it, my mother said it was discriminatory and hateful that we would want out own land. I think a lot of people would feel the same way, bringing a lot of animosity. Laws: Another job for the council. Demographics: We are in no position to give numbers at this time. you won't get a fraction of promised members and it is something that will have to be guess work. Granted, you would need a cap or an expansion eventually, but now take what you can get and prove yourself!
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Permalink Reply by Susan McCauley on -
This is a good discussion to pursue. Perhaps, think outside the box and not assume that what has already transpired in the course of human social development needs to continue. Look at all long-held beliefs about what we can do and not do. Also, learn something of the nature of human ego which, while necessary to a degree to manage existence in the material realm, also operates through fear...fear of separation from "All That Is" and fear that "the other" will 'take' from us. Veganism is on the track to discovering the immense power of creative mental, emotional and spiritual energy. It will be difficult, however, if we continue to assume traditional worldwide cultural beliefs about how to "survive."
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Permalink Reply by Michael Evans on
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Try the Philippine Islands, land is so cheap it is unbelievable but foreigners can not own land there so you have to put it in a local's name. A house built from palm trees costs about £1,500 sterling, does not require planning consent or building laws. growing land suitable for rice, coconuts, vegetables etc.
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Permalink Reply by Development Department on -
I like the idea of having a place in the Philippines. A lot of Asia is quite cheap, we could cater for several times the same number of citizens in some Asian countries than we could in Western ones. I found this society that I think we should get in contact with if we are serious about setting up there.
http://www.paws.org.ph/site/1/default.aspx
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Permalink Reply by Aeri C. on
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Politics - a loosely based socialist government devoted to greater chances of equality. We do not need a communist regime to enforce equality, nor do we need a capitalist divide to praise the wealthy and give the elite few the chance to be blissfully living. Our democratic socialist government would best work on a basis of yearly voting, rather than having to wait 2-5 years to elect a new leader.
Economics - taxes should be adequately present to supply enough to the community, enrich the urban environment, give aid to the struggling (but more than just a cash hand-out). Less funding going towards an already established militia (since the U.S. spends more than 40% of tax dollars on weaponry and militia efforts) and stabilizes the actual monetary gain vs. the utility of the job (i.e. the Snooki's of the world should not be paid more than teachers, plumbers, or even the pizza guy).
Geography - We can only hope for the best of geographic situations, however, a moderate temperature with fairly warm summers and fairly cold winters to keep the traditional view of the seasons in our lives - building snow men, swimming in the sun, jumping in leaves and windy walks through the springtime air - these are the categorical stereotypes of the seasons I'd like to see. Whether there is more shore or less doesn't seem to matter to me personally, however I have always loved cliff-side villas staring out onto a small lake or the ocean.
Ethics - our common ethics of understanding, equality, and rights/freedoms while not impeding on others rights should keep true. Just like we balance out the "right" to eat meat or harm animals with the ethical obligation to harm NO creatures whatsoever, we must also consider subjects such as gender, race, sexuality, and nationality. However, religion is not something I can wholly agree with to dictate our ethics, especially if the only reason someone does something good is because they feel they will have some crazy afterlife reward system. We should do good deeds because we are good people, not because we want rewards.
A push to higher education and raising the bar for post-secondary requirements. It is a way to sort out the abilities of people for the working world - we have the intelligent working on our most intellectually straining jobs, while the more duty and strength oriented go into respectable trades. Having mixed this up many times in society, we come out with businessmen and businesswomen who cannot always do their careers with tact, or those who yearn for career satisfaction but fall short of it.
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